Is there really any difference between だなんて and なんて?

Question

1.「精霊の力を封印できるだなんて規格外の能力、持っているのはこの世にあなた一人だけよ。ーーそのあなたが嫌だと言うのだもの。もうどうしようもないじゃない」

2.「む……そうか。そうだな。シドーから鳶一折紙の匂いがするだなんて、私はどうしてしまったのだろか。シドーがあの女をおぶったりでもしない限り、匂いが付くだなんてありえないというのに」

Hi. I’m reading a novel and I’ve come across these two examples. I’m interested in the bold parts. Are the bold parts used to bring up something unexpected or surprising? If so, can we omit だ and just say なんて in those examples?

But according to this link, there is such a rule as follows:

(2) To bring up something unexpected or to re-quote what you have found out with surprise.

Although there is a slight nuance difference, なんて ( = nante) and だなんて ( = danante) are exchangeable in many cases.（Usually we use だなんて ( = danante) when we quote what someone has said and we use なんて ( = nanate) to refer just the fact you have found out. )

In my examples, according to the context, だなんてs aren’t quoting what someone said but just refer to an expected or surprising fact. So does it mean this rule is invalid and we don’t need to obey it? Or the examples are just the exceptions to the rule? I’m confused by the difference between だなんて and なんて. Please shed some light on it.

Answer 1

This type of だ has been asked several times:

• ~たいだとか why is there a だ here?
• Is 「３人いるだと」 grammatical?
• Usage (correctness) of だと after verbs

だ in your examples are optional, but I feel they are still "quotative" in that they are used to repeat (often with a negative/dubious overtone) something that has been already brought up in the context. (That is, they have been at least thinking or talking about sealing the power of spirits or the smell of a woman.) This does not mean the clause before だ has to be exactly the same as what someone said.

EDIT: Still, there may be cases where だなんて is used for something that is mentioned for the first time (eg ラーメンがこんなに美味しいだなんて知りませんでした!). And the borderline of "quotative" and "non-quotative" is admittedly somewhat blurry in your examples... Maggie sensei says なんて and だなんて are usually interchangeable and だなんて is usually used for quoting, and I think that is true.