Skip to main content
Japanese Language

Return to Question

Tweeted twitter.com/StackJapanese/status/671736842061029377
added 3 characters in body
Source Link
user6595
user6595

I've been thinking recently about patterns between onyomi and their respective Chinese counterparts (as presumably existed in middle Chinese and are now reflected across modern Chinese dialects). Japanese certainly does reflect a lot of the consonant endings that existed in middle Chinese that have been lost in some dialects (particularly Mandarin, which only preserves -r, -n and -ng as consonant finals) (cf. 六 - Mandarin liù, Cantonese luk6, Japanese roku) (cf. 七 - Mandarin qī, Cantonese cat1, Japanese shichi)

I was wondering in particular about the phenomenon regarding the -p final and the -ng final, both of which seem to be widely represented in modern Japanese by the elongation of the vowel sound (cf. 十 - Mandarin shí, Cantonese sap6, Japanese jū) (cf. 零 - Mandarin líng, Cantonese ling4, Japanese reirē/rei). Is there any evidence of earlier Japanese having -ng as a valid phoneme, and if not, is there any particular reason why Japanese would have borrowed these elongated-vowel readings as substitutes for the -ng and the -p finals (especially in the case of the latter, which seems like it would be replicable by Japanese phonology)

I've been thinking recently about patterns between onyomi and their respective Chinese counterparts (as presumably existed in middle Chinese and are now reflected across modern Chinese dialects). Japanese certainly does reflect a lot of the consonant endings that existed in middle Chinese that have been lost in some dialects (particularly Mandarin, which only preserves -r, -n and -ng as consonant finals) (cf. 六 - Mandarin liù, Cantonese luk6, Japanese roku) (cf. 七 - Mandarin qī, Cantonese cat1, Japanese shichi)

I was wondering in particular about the phenomenon regarding the -p final and the -ng final, both of which seem to be widely represented in modern Japanese by the elongation of the vowel sound (cf. 十 - Mandarin shí, Cantonese sap6, Japanese jū) (cf. 零 - Mandarin líng, Cantonese ling4, Japanese rei). Is there any evidence of earlier Japanese having -ng as a valid phoneme, and if not, is there any particular reason why Japanese would have borrowed these elongated-vowel readings as substitutes for the -ng and the -p finals (especially in the case of the latter, which seems like it would be replicable by Japanese phonology)

I've been thinking recently about patterns between onyomi and their respective Chinese counterparts (as presumably existed in middle Chinese and are now reflected across modern Chinese dialects). Japanese certainly does reflect a lot of the consonant endings that existed in middle Chinese that have been lost in some dialects (particularly Mandarin, which only preserves -r, -n and -ng as consonant finals) (cf. 六 - Mandarin liù, Cantonese luk6, Japanese roku) (cf. 七 - Mandarin qī, Cantonese cat1, Japanese shichi)

I was wondering in particular about the phenomenon regarding the -p final and the -ng final, both of which seem to be widely represented in modern Japanese by the elongation of the vowel sound (cf. 十 - Mandarin shí, Cantonese sap6, Japanese jū) (cf. 零 - Mandarin líng, Cantonese ling4, Japanese rē/rei). Is there any evidence of earlier Japanese having -ng as a valid phoneme, and if not, is there any particular reason why Japanese would have borrowed these elongated-vowel readings as substitutes for the -ng and the -p finals (especially in the case of the latter, which seems like it would be replicable by Japanese phonology)

Source Link
user6595
user6595

Pattern in onyomi for middle Chinese -p and -ng finals

I've been thinking recently about patterns between onyomi and their respective Chinese counterparts (as presumably existed in middle Chinese and are now reflected across modern Chinese dialects). Japanese certainly does reflect a lot of the consonant endings that existed in middle Chinese that have been lost in some dialects (particularly Mandarin, which only preserves -r, -n and -ng as consonant finals) (cf. 六 - Mandarin liù, Cantonese luk6, Japanese roku) (cf. 七 - Mandarin qī, Cantonese cat1, Japanese shichi)

I was wondering in particular about the phenomenon regarding the -p final and the -ng final, both of which seem to be widely represented in modern Japanese by the elongation of the vowel sound (cf. 十 - Mandarin shí, Cantonese sap6, Japanese jū) (cf. 零 - Mandarin líng, Cantonese ling4, Japanese rei). Is there any evidence of earlier Japanese having -ng as a valid phoneme, and if not, is there any particular reason why Japanese would have borrowed these elongated-vowel readings as substitutes for the -ng and the -p finals (especially in the case of the latter, which seems like it would be replicable by Japanese phonology)