Tell me more ×
Japanese Language & Usage Stack Exchange is a question and answer site for students, teachers, and linguists wanting to discuss the finer points of the Japanese language. It's 100% free, no registration required.
up vote 3 down vote favorite

Having been trying to write a "sakubun", I must say that I had some trouble to find a reliable translation for the phrase "as you all know" such as:

As you all know, the education system in our country is not so good as it's claimed to be.

As known by all of you, the education system in our country is not so good as it's claimed to be.

I'd appreciate if you translated the whole sentence, however, it's not really necessary.

どうもありがとうございました！

Thank you all in advance!

share|improve this question
7  
どうもありがとうございました→よろしくおねがいします – Chocolate Jan 22 '12 at 15:36
2  
Note that as you all know in English as well as its Japanese counterpart is impolite and inaccurate. You can rarely be sure what all people know. If you use that expression without proof that it is true, you will be lying, and presupposing something about people's mind. A more appropriate expression is as is widely known, 周知のように. – sawa Jan 22 '12 at 19:14
1  
@sawa, it may not be 100% accurate 100% of the time, but "as you all know" is widely used and I wouldn't say that it's "impolite", but perhaps a little less formal than one could otherwise put it. For example, I could easily see Onur's first example sentence said at a conference on how to improve the country's education system, etc... – silvermaple Jan 23 '12 at 0:15
2  
I disagree entirely that "as you all know" is impolite or inaccurate in English. It's used constantly in academic settings to bring up a supporting point that is self-evident or reflects a common assumption. There is a very minor point that it is appropriate for a lecture or talk from an expert. But, frankly, someone who objected to that would be dismissed as hypersensitive. English does NOT have the same guideline as Japanese, that removing the specifics from a phrase tends to make it more polite. – jkerian♦ Jan 23 '12 at 20:24
1  
@jkerian It depends on context. It's also used frequently in political settings to dismiss the opposing opinion as trivial, in which case it can be (and is often) offensive to the opposing party. The example provided by the OP sounds like an opinion rather than an academic statement backed by facts. Then again, the English site is a better place to discuss English usage. – Troyen Jan 24 '12 at 0:17
show 3 more comments

2 Answers

up vote 9 down vote

What you're looking for should be ご存じの通り or ご承知の通り

ご存じの通り、我が国の教育制度は、（+実際には）、言われているほど（or 言われるほど）良いものではありません。

share|improve this answer
Unfortunately I cannot accurately represent "not as good as it's claimed to be". Can someone help me out with this? I sort of cheated with 事実は. By introducing a contrastive は I implicitly created a claim whose truth is being challenged. But how do I explicitly say that it's a claim? – Flaw Jan 22 '12 at 15:11
What about 言われたように良くない – fefe Jan 22 '12 at 15:25
3  
「ご存じの通り（orご存じのように）、我が国の教育制度'は'、（+'実際には'）、言われている'ほど'（or言われるほど）良いもの'では'ありません。」・・・か‌​な～ – Chocolate Jan 22 '12 at 15:55
2  
@Chocolate Answers are for answers :-) – dainichi Jan 22 '12 at 16:17
2  
わが国の教育制度が事実はあまり良くない part does not make sense. – Tsuyoshi Ito Jan 22 '12 at 18:57
show 5 more comments
up vote 2 down vote

Supplement: You also could use 知っている通り（に） toward a more familiar crowd.

share|improve this answer
3  
Why was this downvoted? – istrasci Jan 22 '12 at 22:43
I'm not sure. Maybe it would be more fitting on the above answer as a comment since it's closely related? Still, it's a valid point, "知っている通りに" is fine and used. – CptSupermrkt Jan 23 '12 at 12:42
2  
Hmm...「知っている通りに」・・・？？Well I might say 「知ってると思うけど/知ってるでしょうけど」to friends (but never in a conference) – Chocolate Jan 23 '12 at 13:39
"知っている通りに" in quotes gets about 6 million hits on Google, plenty of examples of usage out there. But for a conference, yeah, definitely not, stick with the keigo. – CptSupermrkt Jan 23 '12 at 14:27
4  
It appears that the vast majority of the Google results for "知っている通りに" are used to mean "[verb] as [I] know how", e.g. "僕は知っている通りに書いた。" There are some examples of 知ってる通りに in the sense of "As [you] know, [some statement of fact]", but the trailing に sounds funny to me. Better to replace the に with a comma or verbal pause: "皆さんが知ってる通り、私は来月退職します。" – Paul Richter Jan 23 '12 at 15:57
show 4 more comments

Your Answer

 
discard

By posting your answer, you agree to the privacy policy and terms of service.

Not the answer you're looking for? Browse other questions tagged or ask your own question.