Take the 2-minute tour ×
Japanese Language Stack Exchange is a question and answer site for students, teachers, and linguists wanting to discuss the finer points of the Japanese language. It's 100% free, no registration required.

I was taught that these two phrases are interchangeable and have the same meaning.

However, I recently wrote a few practice sentences using this grammar point and they were corrected to use ずには instead of ないでは

The sentences I wrote were:

1)知り合いにそっくりだったので、話しかけないではいられなかった。
2)まだ子供なので、許さないではいられなかった。

However, both of these were corrected to:

1)知り合いにそっくりだったので、話しかけずにはいられなかった。
2)まだ子供なので、許さずにはいられなかった。

I was under the impression that both were acceptable and can't find anything stating otherwise. Is there something in particular with these sentences that they can only use ずには? Or am I completely missing something?

share|improve this question
    
My grammar book has them listed under the same heading. The only thing I can think of is that you can't use them talking about a 3rd person, but that applies to both of them so it's not a difference. –  istrasci Aug 25 '11 at 4:26
    
〜ないではいられなかった just doesn't sound right to me. 〜なくてはいられなかった sounds a little better in your examples, but not as good as 〜ずにはいられなかった. It's probably an idiom thing. –  Zhen Lin Aug 25 '11 at 5:58
3  
I've never even seen なくてはいられなかった... D: –  phirru Aug 25 '11 at 6:00
    
@phirru: 7 million results on Google for "なくてはいられ", and 4.4 million for "ないではいられ". –  Zhen Lin Aug 26 '11 at 1:47
add comment

3 Answers

IMO both of these sentences are correct.

1)知り合いにそっくりだったので、話しかけないではいられなかった。
2)まだ子供なので、許さないではいられなかった。

As a native speaker, the sentences did feel a bit odd to me at first. This is probably because ずには is much more frequently used than ないでは. Perhaps this is because it's shorter and easier to pronounce.

My layman advice is to stick to ずには.

share|improve this answer
add comment

Both are same meaning.

「動ーない形」  + 「ないではいられない」 e-g(1).彼のもの真似を見るとおかしくて、笑わないではいられない。

「する」 +「せずにはいられない」

e-g(1).知り合いにそっくりだったので、話しかけずにはいられなかった。

e-g(2).車の多い道路で遊んでいる子供を見て、注意せずにはいられなかった。

share|improve this answer
3  
I don't see how these are different usages. You answer is a little unclear. –  istrasci Aug 25 '11 at 5:06
    
@istrasci : sorry if my answer is unclear –  ZarNge Aug 25 '11 at 8:52
add comment

I would think it would be degree of politeness/formality where ずに seems more polite/formal.

share|improve this answer
2  
~ずに might be slightly more formal than ~ないで, but there is no difference in politeness. –  Tsuyoshi Ito Aug 26 '11 at 1:20
add comment

Your Answer

 
discard

By posting your answer, you agree to the privacy policy and terms of service.

Not the answer you're looking for? Browse other questions tagged or ask your own question.