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On the 助動詞 wikipedia page there is this sentence and I can't make sense of the part in bold:

助詞「の」「ので」「のに」等が続く場合に使われる。連体形だが名詞を修飾することはできない。なお、形容動詞を品詞と認めない立場では別の考え方になる。

Here is my try :

(Those 連体形 are) only used when preceding things like 「の」「のに」「ので」. However, a noun cannot use those 連体形 in order to modify (another element). Moreover, from the view point which does not recognize na-adjectives and (???) parts of speech, there is another way of thinking ???.

May somebody help me so as to understand this part?

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1  
(1) Can you indicate where this sentence is? (2) From your knowledge, what do you expect it to say? –  Tim Jul 24 at 1:18
    
I think 「連体形だが名詞を修飾することはできない」 is saying that "even though な is a 連体形, it cannot modify nouns". I'm unsure about what the last sentence is saying though. –  3 to 5 business days Jul 24 at 4:19
    
@3to5businessdays, Yes, I agree with your proposal for 「連体形だが名詞を修飾することはできない」. –  Lyle Jul 24 at 8:43
    
@Tim, (1) the sentence is the one denoted by a 5 just above the 文語 section. (2) Exactly, what I wrote in my question. The point which troubled me the most was that people could consider 形容動詞 as something other than a "part of speech". If there are not what are they then ? And the presence of と troubled me quite a bit too. –  Lyle Jul 24 at 8:50

1 Answer 1

up vote 5 down vote accepted

I think it's saying...

Those 連体形 (=「そうな」「べきな」「な」 and 「です」) can be followed by particles 「の」「ので」「のに」etc...

例: そうなの・べきなの・なの・ですの
そうなので・べきなので・なので・ですので
そうなのに・べきなのに・なのに・ですのに

... but cannot modify nouns (=cannot be followed by nouns).

例: *そうな机・*べきな机・*な机・*です机

By the way, those who don't recognize na-adjectives as a part of speech (=those who deny na-adjectives) think differently (eg. they consider きれいな机 as "きれい + 助動詞「だ(な)」+ noun", not as "na-adjective + noun").


By the way, the なお is not a 副詞/adverb ("furthermore") but a 接続詞/conjunction ("ちなみに/by the way").

XXをYYと認める means "recognize/consider XX as YY".

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Thank you very much, I really had a hard time with XXをYYと認める but now it is clear. And thanks for なお I did not notice that it was also a conjunction. –  Lyle Jul 24 at 8:35
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Is the line of thinking that na-adj is not a part of speech common? –  3 to 5 business days Jul 24 at 8:48
2  
@3to5businessdays In 広辞苑, they're lumped in with nouns. –  snailboat Jul 25 at 1:15
3  
@3to5businessdays 一応、普通は、日本の小・中・高等学校では、「形容動詞」をひとつの品詞として習います・・・ –  Choko Jul 28 at 12:50

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